T. Graham Brown: Singer-Songwriter, Recording Artist

T. GRAHAM BROWN is one of the most unique voices in country music.  His most recent album “Forever Changed” has been called by some his best work yet. “Forever Changed” received a Grammy nomination for Best Roots Gospel album. If we are judged by the company we keep, T. Graham Brown is the cream of the crop.  His friends in the rock, soul, country and Christian music genres all contributed their vocals to the project, a diverse list that includes Vince Gill, Jason Crabb, Leon Russell, Jeff & Sheri Easter, The Oak Ridge Boys, Steve Cropper, Booth Brothers, Three Bridges, Sonya Isaacs, and Jimmy Fortune.

In addition to original songs co-written by T. Graham Brown, “Forever Changed” features interpretations of songs like the Curtis Mayfield classic, “People Get Ready” which fits perfectly in Brown’s hands.  The album ends with a version of “Wine Into Water,” which deals with the topic of addiction.

 In this interview, T. Graham Brown talks about his roots, the inspiration behind “Forever Changed,” the challenges he overcame and his friendship with songwriter Bruce Burch.

 

Sir Tim Rice: Lyricist

The great lyricist Sir Tim Rice, songwriting collaborator with Andrew Lloyd Webber, Alan Menken, Elton John and many others talks about his great career in writing songs for theatre and film.  Sir Tim Rice co-wrote songs for Jesus Christ Superstar, Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat, Evita and many others as well as Disney animated films like Aladdin and The Lion King.

What do you think is the greatest Tim Rice lyric?

Tom Wopat: Singer, Actor

TOM WOPAT is known by many people as an actor, but in listening to any of his albums, you will understand why he identifies himself as a singer first and foremost.  It was STILETTO Entertainment who introduced me to Wopat’s album “Consider it Swung!”  I am very glad they did, as anyone who listens to him singing can testify.  The impressive thing about Tom Wopat is that he seems to transition so effortlessly between an American Songbook standard like “That’s Life” and a very unique take on the Bobbie Gentry classic “Ode to Billie Joe.”  The album even features “Thailand Sea,” a song written by Wopat, and it’s lyrics tell a great story.  I would invite music lovers to please give Mr. Wopat a listen.

Ladies and gentlemen, it’swith great pleasure we welcome our special guest, Mr. Tom Wopat.  Thanks so much for joining us.

Thank you, man.

My first question…it’s simple but it trips a lot of people up.  Who is Tom Wopat?

God, I don’t know.  Singer…that’s probably what I’d think of myself as.  Over the years, I guess I’ve thrown some acting shots so I do that as well but, um, I’m primarily a singer. 

What was life like growing up?

It was great!  I mean, my whole family was musical…a dairy farm in Wisconsin back in the fifties and sixties so, our public education was real good.  I lived in a small town so I got to do everything in high school…I was on all the teams, in band and in chorus and did the shows…you know, the whole nine yards.

What music were you listening to?

I think probably the first huge influence would have been the Beatles in the early sixties.  It was about seventh grade, that’s when I really, really became aware of pop music.  I think that you could make a case that most of the, most of the guys up in my age group between fifty-five and sixty-five, probably if they’re in the business, the Beatles led to everything.  They just put such a shine on the whole affair.

You have very diverse musical tastes.  Could you pick a favorite genre of music?

You know, for many, the country thing was more of an aberration.  I didn’t grow up really listening to it perseit and of course, back in the day, there wasn’t some niche-oriented I mean, nearly as it is today.  You’d hear country music next to rock-n-roll and a lot of that stuff back in the old top forty days, back in the fifties and sixties.  You know, I grew up listening to pop, but singing show tunes and doing that stuff, you know, in high school and college.  I studied voice at the University of Wisconsin so I studied opera and art songs and German Lieder  Actually I would’ve been a Lieder singer, singing like Mahler and Brahms and Schubert and that kind of stuff very well…but, um, I’m a baritone and it was really right in my wheel house.  I think what happened with country is that we were doing ‘Dukes’ and the opportunity came up and in those days, I mean, country was really kind of the MOR today…that was right around in cowboy time when all that stuff became really popular and you can say that country music was really the MOR music of the time. 

I want to talk about who your favorite songwriters are. 

Wow…well that’s a pretty diverse group.  You know, when you get into the songbook side of things, you’ve got to include Irving Berlin and Frank Loesser, Harold Arlen, Rodgers & Hammerstein, of course.  Rodgers & Hart…any number of them.  When you talk about pop stuff, I’m a big Joni Mitchell fan, Bob Dylan, the singer-songwriters I like a lot…I like James Taylor… always been a big fan of his, you know, the way he styles a song.  There’s a song on that record that you have that’s called ‘Thailand Sea’ which is pretty much a Joni homage, you know, pretty much a Joni Mitchell style lyric and melody. 

I wanted to ask you about that song.  Tell me about ‘Thailand Sea’ and the inspiration.

I was in Thailand doing a movie in 2006.  I did a movie over there called ‘The Hive.’  It was kind of a low-budget, British Thai film and I hadn’t written a song in probably four or five years.  The place is so beautiful.  I was staying in a hotel on the Thailand Sea, up on the twelfth floor, the mountains right outside my window…it was really something and it was something that really moved me to take out the guitar and put it together so that’s what it ended up to be.  I think it’s actually a charming…a decent little piece of poetry.  I’m happy the way it came out.  You know, it really is one of the eclectic edges of this record.  I mean, the record goes in a lot of different directions which, I mean, you’ve got ‘Beacon Blues’ on there, a Lou Rawls thing, and a lot of different things.  You’ve got full-on Gershwin on it.  You know, we were kind of happy that we could meld all those things onto one record.

How did you go about choosing these songs?

Most of the selections were mine.  Dave Finck, the producer, had quite a bit of input, like the ‘Ode to Billie Joe’ was his idea.  Again, it’s kind of another eclectic edge to the record.  It’s definitely as far country as we go, a pretty haunting tune…a pretty stand-alone rendition, I think.  You won’t hear another version like it.  That’s kind of basically what we’re doing was kind of taking the different tastes that we both have and putting them together on a record.  There’s a Frischberg on there called ‘You’d Rather Have the Blues’.  It turns into a huge swing number.  That kind of stuff was an awful lot of fun to do. 

Well on that note, could you pick a favorite track from the album?

I’d have to say the ‘But Not for Me’ just cause of the ending of it.  It swings so hard.

What vocalists have influenced you the most?

Sinatra and Ella and Louis are all up there at the top of the list as far as songbook stuff goes.  Then there’s….I like Sting, uh, I like what he does to songs and the way he’ll turn the beat around a little bit.  God, I’m a Delbert fan.  I like Delbert McClinton a lot.  As far as this particular genre of the mixture of pop and standards, I would have to say Diana Krall is right at the top of the list.

Oh yeah, she’s great. 

She is great and not only a great musician, but an intuitive vocalist I think, and her piano playing is even better than her vocals so, you know, it’s a nice package. 

Do you have a preference personally when it comes to either performing songs live or working in a studio recording an album, like this album, ‘Consider it Swung’?

The live thing is what it’s all about.  I mean, that’s what the album’s for anyway is to promote the live stuff.  Over the years, just by sheer (laughs) osmosis, I think I’ve kind of developed a certain style in the studio and absorbed a lot of technique from different people and different producers.  Russ Titelman  was a huge influence… the first jazz record I made, ‘In the Still of the Night’…amazing….really terrific producer.  Ben Sidron on the record that I did, the Arlen record, he brought a wonderful approach to things.  I think for being a non-singer, he was really conducive to getting a good vocal in the studio.  A lot of his stuff was basically pretty much live.  We don’t punch them and comp them very much.  There’s maybe three or four that had kind of been pieced together.  Like the first song, ‘That’s Life,’ that’s pretty much a live track, you know, live in the studio.  But we did very little to it. 

In your personal opinion, do you think sometimes in a recording studio when an album is being made, when a track is done over and over and some of the techniques and the technology, do you think we’re maybe losing some of the soul of music in the process?

Oh absolutely.  I think, you know, a lot depends on the artist.  A lot of today’s pop artists, it’s how they’ve been raised to use comping stuff and not worrying about a total performance from beginning to end.  For me, I was brought up, you know, in a different day.  I started singing in the fifties really.  My first recording would’ve been in the 80’s but you know, over thirty years you tend to develop a certain thing and I’ve been a live performer over the years between doing all the performance with different bands and then Broadway shows or Broadway type shows.  For me, eventually, it really informs how I record a song.  As you get to a song, just the physical aspects to a song, say ‘But Not For Me,’ where there’s a certain fatigue aspect when you get towards the end…it lends a different kind of quality to your voice and a sort of urgency to the production that I think you miss if you just totally comp something together so that it’s perfect.  And the days of doing things like Steely Dan did…the analog approach, it’s…basically, what they would do is record a song and then they would replace everything—piece by piece by piece meticulously.

Mr. Wopat, you’re a man that’s worn a lot of hats.  You’ve appeared in countless Broadway shows.  You’ve been in television.  You’ve been on film.  Are there any dreams that you have yet to see become a reality?

Directing.  I’ve done it a little bit in my past.  I directed some of the episodes of ‘Dukes’ and I directed some stage stuff a little bit at Summerstock.  A few more years and I may not care to see myself in front of a camera (Laughs) anymore.  I do like to take the hands-on approach.  I mean, with this last record, I would have to say that I was as involved with production as I’ve ever been and more so.  But I think that’s the difference, you see…I like being in control so I expect some direction to come and maybe, maybe even producing a record or two.  That would be fun too.

You already have envisioned maybe a next record?

We’re actually in the process right now.

Wow!

 We’ve not been in the studio yet but we are in final approach to it I think.  It depends on David’s schedule.

What is the best thing about being Tom Wopat?

(Laughs)  I have a high standard of performance.  (Laughs)

(Laughs)  Well, I have two final questions.  One is somewhat lighthearted and the next one is a little more serious. 

Right.

But for the lighthearted one: What is your all-time favorite meal?

Oh.  I was discussing that the other day over some lobster…probably lobster and sweet corn.

Lobster and sweet corn?

Yeah.

Together?  Is that a combination that works especially well?

No, I don’t mix them.  I have a lobster and a couple ears of sweet corn.

Alright.  For my final question: this broadcast goes out all over the world…what would you like to say to all the people who are listening in?

Enjoy the day.  Seize the day. And music is a great part of that. 

Well sir, thank you so much for this interview.  I hope to see you perform in Atlanta at some point.

That’d be great!  I expect to be down there sometime. 

Alright, well have a good one.

Thanks a lot brother.

TRANSCRIBED BY LORI DOMINGO.

Scott English: Lyricist, Recording Artist, Producer

SCOTT ENGLISH wrote the lyrics to the song “Brandy,” while Richard Kerr composed the melody.  The title was changed to “Mandy” and it was recorded by Barry Manilow.  Interviews with Scott English are very rare, so it was a great pleasure to speak with this great artist.  Scott makes his home in England these days.  We may be recording a second interview at some point, in person.  One thing is for sure, Scott English loves music.  We hope to talk with him again when his book comes out.

Ladies and Gentlemen, it is with great pleasure, we welcome our very special guest, the great Scott English. Thank you so much for joining us.

My pleasure.


I think most stories are best from the beginning. What was life like growing up for you?

 

Tough, very tough, but music kept me going, I listened to the radio all the time, it came to me, you know, I just kept on keeping on, everybody said I was nuts, you know, Sheldon, he’s crazy, you know, he’s going to be a singer, he’s going to be this, he’s going to be that, you know, they all thought I was nuts. I put my name on records.


You said you put your name on records?

 

Yeah, every record I would see I would scratch off the name of the Penguins or Al Martino or Tony Bennett and I would put my name on them, cause I wanted to see what it looked like and the first time I saw my name on a record, I just had a…it was like… unbelievable, I couldn’t believe it, once (Scott laughs) some people at Sceptre Records, wanted to tease me, so they made my record a key ring for the toilet.

Ohhhhhh…

I was very, very upset.


Tell us, what kind of music did you hear growing up?

Growing up I heard Nat Cole, Jerry Vale, Tony Bennett, and then suddenly, I had a radio station WBLJ in Harlem New York, an R&B station, it changed my life, I heard the do ups, it was just like… it would made me feel good, I would buy a record and I would play it fifty times, a hundred times, you know, I scratched it all up, I wanted it so bad, you know, I wanted to consume everything in music.


What was some of the doo wop songs that you liked the most?

Johnny Ace, ???  Miller, The Penguins, most of all I liked the Moonglows, Marvin Gaye came from the Moonglows, ?? Producer came from the Moon Glows,  I genuinely know all those names, you know the Moonglows?

I’m not really familiar to be honest.

Well look it up, they’re a very good group.

I’ll have to give them a play.

Okay, in 1960 there was a single that came out ‘Four Thousand Miles Away.’

Yeah.

Tell us about that song.

It was the ‘B’ side of ‘High On A Hill.’


Who wrote that song?

Frank Carey.

What was it like to see that album with your name on it, finally.

Like an orgasm. (Paul laughs, Scott continues), I’d made it as far as I was concerned, I didn’t have to do anything else, it was wonderful, I was there. I was Prince Charles


I also want to also ask you about a song called ‘High On A Hill’.

Yeah.

Great song.

That broke my heart twice, that broke my heart twice, Kennedy killed me once, the Beatles killed me the second time, did you know that?

I didn’t know that, no.

Yeah, well, my record was going up in the charts in November 20th 1960, President Kennedy got shot, they took all the records off the radio. Somewhere at Sceptre records, they re-released the record, they released my record, it was number one in LA, number one in San Francisco, number one in Philadelphia, big in Detroit, then the Beatles happened. Nine out of ten records on the charts, one record was mine in San Francisco, and it killed me, it broke my heart.

I also wanted to ask you about the song ‘Bend Me, Shake Me’.


I wrote it with Larry Weiss, great writer, he also wrote ‘Rhinestone Cowboy’ by himself.

How did you meet Larry Weiss?


I was working for a music publisher whose a great arranger called Klaus Alderman and Larry walked into the office, he was one of the people that Klaus knew who played him songs, and I was wearing a red jacket, with a white scarf and white loafers, and I said ‘ahhhh Hollywood, Hollywood’ and we became lifelong friends and writing partners.


Do you still stay in touch with him?


I just spoke to him last night.

Oh yeah, do you still write songs?


Larry still writes songs, yeah.


What about you?


He lives in Nashville, he started to get a hotel, the Rhinestone Cowboy hotel up and going and a musical with Rhinestone Cowboy.  He’s charging hard. I can’t see him with much fruition there you know.

Are you still writing songs?


Like crazy. Like crazy, I wrote two today, I had two on Friday and my partner in Ireland, Owen, that was yesterday and they’re amazing.


Are you writing songs to be recorded by others?


Yeah, I’m 76 years old, you don’t want to see me record (Paul laughs).


There’s another song that you wrote that has endured, and the name of it has been changed when it was recorded by Barry Manilow, but I’m talking about your song “Brandy.”


Yeah, yeah, another break… ahhhh, what happened, I was in the South of France and one of my publishing friends started to say “aaaah Brandy goes down fine after dinner doesn’t she?” He was trying to tell a dirty joke, but I got a great title out of that and I wrote the lyric and when I came back to London, I called Richard Kerr, my partner at the time and we got together that day in my area with an out of tune piano and we wrote the song and it was magic, yeah, out of tune we wrote it, we did a demo and we sent it out and nobody liked the demo, so I figured I’d better do it myself, so I did it for a record company and then, I was playing it for people and the people from Ireland heard it, Ireland Records… they said “what are you doing with that?” I said well I got a deal to release two of the sides he said “how you going to do it”, I said … he said “play em one other and leave Brandy out”, I said “why?” He said “I want to release it on Ireland”, Trojan, sorry, that’s what happened. My wife was pregnant, home to America, and bang, two weeks later they call me and it’s in the charts. I came here on tour, I did a couple of gigs, a lot of TV shows, no a lot of radio shows sorry, I went on Top Of The Pops, and Top Of The Pops it was going up in the charts, the Union stopped me because I hadn’t done enough gigs, the next week it went from twelve to eleven and then from eleven to nine, and then it died.


What inspired Brandy?

What inspired? Well, my life. If you look into the lyric it’s talking about looking for ‘a man, a face through a window’, that’s my Father.


Wow.


And then this woman, I treated her bad and I didn’t know any better, and that was me, you know, it was a life of ups and downs, I knew better, but at times I couldn’t do better.


What did you think of the interpretation Barry Manilow recorded of it?


In the beginning, I hated it, because he took out one of the verses, half ofone of the verses and made it into a ‘bridge’, and he changed the rhythm, he made it real ‘poppy, you know, but after it got played and played and played, checks started coming in, he asked me what I thought of it, and I told him, I said “Barry I ended up loving you buying me houses.” (Paul laughs, Scott continues) That was Brandy.


Do you still see Richard Kerr quite a bit?


I saw Richard last week, Richard’s suffering from cancer right now, he’s seventy years old, he’s a gentleman if there ever was a gentleman, but with writing, he’s still writing beautifully, people are still looking for our songs, he’s got mellow with age as a writer, like Chopin.


How do you feel about his abilities as a composer?


I’m very happy he’s alive.  He made me, we’re tight and I don’t think I would have on my own. He’s a blessing, you know people ought to give thanks and look around, you know, smell the flowers, and accept that no man is an island.


Interesting. Of all the songs you have written, which one would you say means the most to you?


I think ‘Who Turned The World Around,’ recorded by Bobby Darin, it never was a hit, it was just on an album on Montown, but that means the most to me.


Tell me about the inspiration behind that song.


Well, it’s just all these tsunamis now and all these earthquakes, I just pictured that happening, but this was in 1971. I said ‘One day after Armageddon,’ you know, the end of the world and destruction of the world ‘and fire was going out, rumours of life in Cincinnati,  gone from words of mouths, walking’s the only way to get there, maybe I’ll find a way, that was the morning I remember, that was before the rain, who turned the world around, who turned the world around, show me the way to yesterday, who turned the world around’.


Are you more moved by the lyrics of a song, or the melody?

I love melody, but I’m a word man, I write the words, I’m a lyricist, but I love melody,
when I hear ‘A Whiter Shade Of Pale’


Oh yeah.


That organ. It just drives me nuts, the melody, I love classical music, so I have to say I like instrumental, I love Chopin and Beethoven and Tchaikovsky and people like that.

What about the lyricists that have influenced you the most, who do you think are the best lyricists in music?


Sammy Cahn, Jimmy Van Heusen, Elton John, Paul McCartney, John from the Beatles.


Yeah, John Lennon.


Well, some of my friends like Graham Nash, James Taylor, James Brown.


Yeah.


He wrote it in grooves, but if you look into what he wrote, he wrote some stuff that meant something.


Yeah.


‘It’s A Man’s World’, if you listen to those words, he said it in a very crude way, but wowwww, ‘without a woman or a girl’, what are we nuts?


I also wanted to ask you about the song ‘Ciao Baby.’


Yeah, I love that song.


It’s a good one, tell me about that song being written.


It was a very hard one, it was so many rhymes that I had to write, it was quite difficult, Larry came in with the melody and I went home with it over the weekend and nobody one could contact me, you know, I was in my head, in the car or in a restaurant, in the bath, no one could reach me ‘Ciao baby, let’s call it a day, ciao baby, go ahead and through your love away’. People just, they just ate that song up, I thought it would be an enormous, enormous hit, but it was little hits, in Australia it was number one, teens here in England, in America it was recorded by a lot of people, might have gone to number fifteen in the charts or something like that.


There was another song ‘Hi Ho Silver Lining.’


That’s a song I never wanted him to finish.


What do you mean by that?


I never liked it.


Oh really?


What happened was, Larry Weiss came into the office, and he had the chorus, simply said “yeah and it’s obvious’, so he put that on the end of the chorus, then he said ‘oh come on, write the lyrics and a verse’, so I wrote ‘you’re everywhere and nowhere baby, that’s where you’re at, going down a bumpy hillside, in your hippy hat, flying across the country and getting fat, saying everything is groovy when your tires are flat’, and then there’s the chorus ‘high ho silver lining’ and he loved it and he said ‘wowwww’, I said “it’s shit’. (Paul laughs), he called Mickey Most in London, you know the name Mickie Most?

I don’t know that one, I’m sorry.


You don’t know Mickie Most, he’s a producer after, what’s-his-named, who was in jail for killing that woman.


You’re talking about that guy Phil Spector.


Phil Spectre, he’s the English Phil Spector, he produced The Animals, he produced Herman’s Hermits, he produced hundreds of people, then he had Rack Records years later, he heard that song and said “I’m coming to New York, I want it”. Larry played it on the phone, Mickie came into my offices “where’s the song?”, I said “Mickie I’m not finishing it, it stinks”, he said “no, you finish it right now”, (Paul laughs, Scott continues), I called my secretary and said “bring a pencil and paper”, we had no computers in those days, so I said “take a letter”, I said “flies are in your pea soup baby and they’re waving at me, anything you want is yours now, only nothing’s for free, lies are gonna get you some day, just wait and see, just open up your beach umbrella, while you’re watching TV, and it’s hi ho silver lining”, he said “that’s incredible”, I thought he’d say “it’s shit”, and I just recited it off the top of my head, and he called me about two weeks later, he said “I’m giving it to Yardbirds” I said “are you nuts? Yardbirds is a heavy rock group”, it’s a song for Herman’s Hermits” (Paul laughs, Scott continues), so about two weeks later I got a record, a fantastic record by a man named Jeff Beck, I never heard of him, he was in the Yardbirds, you know.


Yeah.


Well, when I heard the record I felt terrible, I thought I’d killed his career, although it went in the charts in England, in America it didn’t do too well, it went in the charts in England I thought I’d killed his career, I heard the ‘B’ side of the record called ‘Beck’s Bolero’.


Yeah.


That’s amazing, that instrumental , him playing this instrumental, it’s incredible, and I figured I’d killed…. and he never had another single out as a singer, then one day I’m here in London and the head of Warner Brothers ?? and Larry ?? said to me ???? at the Rainbow Theatre,  I said “I can’t go. He said “why,” I said “I don’t want to see that guy I killed his career,”, he said “come on,” so, he took me, I said I didn’t want to go back stage after or nothing, he got me so loaded, next thing I know, I’m back stage, and there’s Jeff Beck and I looked at him and I said “man, do I have to apologise to you”, he said “no, wait a minute, before you say a word I have to apologise to you” he said “I always wanted to record that song, I begged Mickey for the song, the only thing I didn’t like was the over dub, the guitar over dub, Mickey wouldn’t let me do it again”, then he said “what’s your problem” (Paul laughs, Scott continues) I told him, he laughed, he said “no man, I always wanted to do that song,”, you see what the mind tells you?


Yeah.


You’ve also done some record producing, tell us about producing Thin Lizzie’s debut album.


Thin Lizzie I got fired from. They blamed me for getting the kids high when it was Phil Lynott’s Mother who brought the dope into the studio.


Interesting.. (Paul laughs, Scott continues)..


Yeah, his Mother brought the dope into the studio and they blamed me in the book. I don’t know, there was a guy at Decca who wanted me out because he wanted to produce the group and he made the big hits with them, I didn’t.


What about your song ‘Where Are You’?


Aaaaah, the Eurovision song, I thought that would do well, we came second, we got beaten by a transvestite, an Israeli transvestite. I never thought that a transvestite could beat us, cause all the bookies were saying that we were going to win, that’s another town that was dreadful, a terrible city called Birmingham.


Well, speaking of England what brought you over there?

Music, I was writing with Larry and Klaus Alderman and Klaus decided he wanted to be travelling around the world playing songs for people, and he picked me to go with him, that’s what broke Larry and I up eventually, though we made up years later.

Do you like living in the United Kingdom?


Yeah, I do, I do, I really do, I like the tempo, but I have a good time when I go back to the States, I’ve moved back at times.


You’ve moved back?


In 1977, I did an album in LA, I bought a house, I lived there till 1980 and then I came back to England again.


England remains your home?


Yeah, like I’ve been taken prisoner. (Paul laughs)


Aaaah I see.


I’m married four times.


So, what is the best thing about being Scott English?


That someday there’s going to be a plaque on the wall that says ‘Scott English lived here’ and that I meant something, that I didn’t waste my life as I thought I would when I was sixteen when I was in jail, it was a rocky road as a kid, I was in and out of jails and orphanages and foster homes and it was rocky, it was hard.


Yeah.


So, I found the music business and I started hanging around the Brill Building.


Interesting.


What is on the horizons for you?


Well, I’m writing my book now.


Interesting. Tell us about the book.


It’s about my life, everything I told you about is in the book.


All right, well, we’ll be looking forward to that for sure.

It’s quite humorous, blowing the bubble on a couple of people (Paul laughs, Scott continues),mainly Sharon Osbourne.

I see.
 


My last question, actually I have two. This interview will be heard by people for all over the world. What do you want to say to all those people who are listening to us.

Hey, what do I want to say? Thank you for being patient.  Thank you for taking the time to listen to my words, and I hope I can continue to please you.

Who is Scott English?


Who is Scott English? Sheldon David English, born to Jewish people in Brooklyn 1937, who had a dream and he kept his dream, he stepped on a couple of people, but he kept his dream.


Well Mr. English, it has been a great pleasure to do this interview, I really appreciate it.


Hey, Paul thank you. Would like to meet you when I’m in New York.


I hope we get to shake hands one day.

TRANSCRIBED BY ROSALIND WINTON

Marty Panzer: Lyricist

Marty Panzer is a great lyricist who has songs known all over the world. He began writing songs with his friend Barry Manilow when they started working in the CBS-TV mailroom. They wanted a career in music so they began writing commercial jingles. From there, you could say Marty Panzer’s songs have more than taken off–he wrote songs for Barry Manilow like “It’s a Miracle,” “This One’s for You,” “All the Time,” and “Even Now.” Not only has Marty Panzer written songs for Barry Manilow, but he wrote the Kenny Rogers classic “Through the Years.” His songs have been recorded by the likes of Dionne Warwick, Frankie Valli, Gladys Knight, Julio Iglesias, Dusty Springfield, and others. Marty Panzer has 35 gold and platinum records, four BMI million play awards, a 3 million play award, and record sales in excess of 70 million units.

“An Evening with Marty Panzer,” featuring songs, stories and performances by many guest composers and artists (including Diane Schuur and a special guest performance by Barry Manilow), had it’s world premier at the Coronet Theatre in Los Angeles, benefitting the Academy For New Musical Theatre.

For 17 years Marty Panzer has taught a workshop on songwriting at UCLA. His songs are loved by many, and the host of this show is no exception. It is our pleasure to welcome a great and passionate lyricist, a man who says he is about “things that last.”

Ladies and Gentlemen, it is our great pleasure to welcome our special guest, Mr. Marty Panzer.  Thanks so much for making the time to do this interview.

Happy to be here, and it is a great pleasure for me as well.

Who is “Marty Panzer”?

“Marty Panzer” is a very lucky guy, who works very hard to stay that way.  My mom was the center of my universe, and then CBS, and then Barry.  And now, songwriting.

A songwriter.  Would you say you focus more on the lyrics, or the melodies?

Ninety percent, lyrics.  Over the last couple of years, I’ve actually begun writing some melodies to lyrics I’m writing, but that’s a very new thing.  Primarily, it’s been lyrics.

So, take us back a while, and tell us what was life like growing up?

It was very isolated.  It was just my mom and I in a small one-bedroom apartment in Brooklyn.  We didn’t have very much money.  My mom always made sure that I was happy.  I never knew the difference.  We were the same as everyone else who lived in the area.  There was always a lot of music.  A lot of music playing, all the time.  And maybe that’s why we were so happy!

And what kind of music did you hear around the house?

Mice fencing.  We had a lot of mice.  And you would hear them fighting with each other all night long.  But, I don’t know if you could consider that music, but after we got past the mice fencing, we found, well, you know, in order really, for years, I was obsessed with Jackie Wilson.  I just loved the performance quality, I loved the orchestra quality.  When Jackie Wilson passed, I found Andy Williams.  Andy sang all the popular songs of the time, but when he sang them, I could finally understand the words.  And the words were always the most important thing to me.

Now, why do you think that is?  That the words are the most important thing to you?

Because they move me!  Because words in a book, words in a letter, words in a note- words move me in a way that visual art doesn’t.  I’ve gone to all the great art institutes, and, you know, walked around for five hours, and never seen anything that looked more inspiring than, ‘Oh, that’s nice yellow’.  ‘Oh, that’s great blue.’  And, I come out of there, and other people are crying, and heaving sighs, and, and, I don’t even understand it.  But, on a word, you can get me.  On a word, you can get me, and, and it, and it fills my head with emotion, and, and words have always been able to do that to me.

I remember when I was a really young kid, I would take the subway to CBS, and I read the first Rod McKuen book, which I think was “Listen To The Warm”, and I had experienced none of these emotions, none of these feelings, none of these heartbreaks, none of these joys, none of, none of any of the things he was speaking about.  And yet, I cried like a baby, on the subway.  It was all so real and so moving, and I wondered, God!  Will I ever have as rich a life?  Will anybody ever love me as much?  Will I ever love anybody as much?  Will I lose?  Will I win?  Will I live without?  Will I live with?  The power of words reached me when I was very young.

Can you remember early things you wrote, whether a poem or a story, not necessarily lyrics?

I only remember this because my mom would remind me.  I wrote an article for public school about the two dogs that were sent into space- Litvak and Latka, or Latka and -somebody else?  Two, a black and a white dog that were sent up in Sputnik and it was a big deal!  I made the front page of my fourth grade newspaper, and I was quite the celebrity at that time!  We’re planning to turn that into a Broadway musical with PETA’s approval– not really!  It’s just the first thing you asked, the first thing I ever wrote- that actually really is the first thing I ever wrote!

That really hits home for me!  I’ll tell you about that in an email.  What about the first lyrics you ever wrote?

Well, you know, Barry and I were always at the piano- at CBS, after CBS, between mail runs, in between all the things that were happening- we were always at the piano.  I can’t ever tell you the first we ever wrote, but one we wrote at the very beginning was,

(Recites)

The first lady I know
She is sweeter than an apple pie
The Sunday school kind of Golden Rule kinda girl mom wants you to try
And yet I met her at a noisy bar
Where all the noisy boys congregate
She understood
Wouldn’t do any good
But she was just too lonely to wait

That song had a beginning, a middle, an end, and we were so proud we had finally written a complete song!  So, that’s one of the earliest- I mean that’s not the entire song- but that’s the beginning of one of the earlier songs.

It almost worked like a spoken-word piece.

Well, it had music- it had fabulous music!  Barry wrote fantastic music.

(Sings)
The first lady I know
She is far more sweeter…

I mean he wrote beautiful music to it.  It was before we really started recording or anything, but it had beautiful music to it.  Who knows?  With Barry, you never know.  He could be singing it now.  He never forgets anything.  He could be singing it now in Uruguay at the Festival of the Arts.  Who knows?

So, where do you get the inspiration to write something?

“This One’s For You”, and “Even Now”, and “It’s A Miracle”, all happened to me.  So, sometimes real events precipitated the songs, and it was just what was coming out of me through every pore, and meant so much to me, that I was fortunate to have an output to be able to express it.  So, lots of it-  Marilyn and Alan Bergman, two of the most famous songwriters of all time, she was the president of ASCAP- Marilyn and Alan once told me,  “A songwriter, or maybe, especially a lyricist, is always going within himself to bring up new ideas.  Therefore, you have to replenish the well inside you by reading, by listening, by learning, by communicating, by being aware of the universe.”  And I think I am.  I think I am.  I mean, if there’s an award for watching “Hardball” seven times a day, I’d probably get it.  And, so, my inspiration comes from what I see every day, and also, sadly or happily, from the things that really happen to me.

So, take us back to this CBS mailroom.  What was that job like, and I’m wondering, did your mind wander a lot when you thought of stuff you could write?


You know, the mailroom was piles and piles and piles of paper.  But, it was all show biz.  It was the exciting new world I had always dreamed of finding.  When I was alone in that one-bedroom apartment in Brooklyn with my mom, I said, ‘There must be more to this!  There must be a world out there with bright people, handsome people!  People that were learning and living and doing more than I was doing!’  And CBS was the place.  So, I really loved every moment of it, from the mailroom, till I became the manager of On-Air Operations.  If my mind ever wandered, it was to those beautiful and handsome people that were everywhere in the company!  I hadn’t seen those kind of people in Brooklyn, not a one!

He’s been your friend for a long time, and he’s also been a songwriting partner.  What is he like to work with, creatively?


He’s mean!  He’s vicious!  He’s insensitive!  He- no.  No, no, no, really!  He’s a fountain of creative ideas.  Barry has more ideas in a minute, than the United Nations has in forty years.  He’s also a perfectionist.  That’s a very good trait, and that’s part of the reason he’s been successful so long.  And, he’s also the most appreciative person I’ve ever met.  He is so happy when we write something- especially regarding the writing- when we write something, it means so much to him that we’ve done this together, we have a special joy that comes from being best buddies, from appreciating, from hearing in our head, the same ideal.  And so, when we accomplish that, he’s very appreciative, and so am I.  It’s nothing but a joyful relationship.

What was it like the first time you ever heard something you wrote performed on the radio, or on a record?

Well, I grabbed my pants, I said good-bye to whoever I was with, and I ran to call Barry!  What else could I do?

I said, ‘Barry, put the radio on!  You can’t believe it!  It’s actually our song in the radio!’
And he said, “WHAAAT!” (Laughs)

It was great!  It was great!  It was just- it was, it was a little unreal, you know?  I think at that time we were so young, we didn’t realize how difficult it was, and how extraordinary it was, we know that as years have gone on.  You can’t get on the radio.  But, for us, it was just, smooth as silk.  We wrote the songs, we released the songs, everyone loved the songs, our record company supported the songs, and they were on the radio, and they sold a million copies before the end of the week.  So, we were very fortunate.  We were very fortunate then, and appreciate it now, probably even more than we did then.

 We’re talking with lyricist Marty Panzer.  You’re songs have been covered by a lot of influential people.  What is it like today- you said you’re even, almost more appreciative- but what is it like now, when you hear someone, you’re flipping through the radio, and -BAM! -there’s your song?

Well, you know, Daft Punk was a revelation!  We never heard “Who’s Been Sleeping In My Bed” exactly covered like Daft Punk actually covered it.  But, we were very happy with it.

You know, the ones that stand out are- Teddy Pendergrass did a magnificent version of “This One’s For You”, and it was after his accident, and the cover of the album had Teddy standing up.  And it was his way of saying, “I’m okay.  I can stand up.”  And he did this beautiful version of “This One’s For You”.  I always loved it.

Diane Schuur- when Barry produced the Diane Schuur album- she sang as brilliantly, and as emotionally as I could ever dream.  I mean, that was perfection.  When Diane Schuur sang “Life Is Good”, I would sit on the piano bench next to her, holding her hand, and we would both cry.  It took a hundred and fifty takes, because we kept crying, and they had to start over again, but it was just absolutely heart-wrenching.  She’s so good!

Well, we recently had the opportunity to interview Diane Schuur, and the album you’re talking about, “Midnight,” you talked a moment there about what a pleasure it was. But, what was it like working with her?

I’ll tell you, if you have the time, I’ll tell you a wonderful story, what impressed me the first time I ever saw her.

I went down to San Juan Capistrano where she was playing at a club, and she looked great and she sounded great, and there wasn’t anything remarkable about that, I knew she sounded great, she was a multi Grammy-winning artist.  But then, in the middle of the show, she said to the audience- she said to the audience,

“You know this year, I had an operation that could have lost my voice forever.  But it didn’t.” She said, “This year, I’ve lost forty pounds!”  She said, “This year, I’m loved by a man more than I’ve ever been loved by anyone in my life.”  And, “This year, I am eleven years sober.”

Well.  I just fell back in the chair.  I was so impressed with her honesty and with the fact that she was smart enough to realize that her life was so wonderful at this time.  Smart enough to realize that.  Not everyone is!

I ran outside, called Barry, and told Barry the story, and he said, “That’s the song!”

And we wrote the song, because I had never heard of a song that said, “Life Is Good!”  I never heard of a song that talked about, “I know life is good!  I’m happy, and I’m grateful, and I’m thankful, and I’m appreciative.”  It’s one of my favorite songs ever!  She did a brilliant job of it, and I just love the lady.

Well, speaking of legends, it had to have been thrilling to have Frankie Valli record a song of yours.  Tell us about the song he did, and what did you think of his rendition?

He recorded a song that was my second record ever with Richard Kerr.  Richard Kerr had written the music to “Mandy” and “Looks Like We Made It” and “I’ll Never Love This Way Again”, and Richard was one of the great ones.  The great writer of the Seventies and Eighties, the great melodist of the Seventies and Eighties.  And this was one the new songs we had written, and listening to the legendary Frankie Valli’s voice on top of a song written with Richard Kerr was stupefying.

But strangely, or just by coincidence, I met Frankie Valli about two, three months ago, at a party for Neil Sedaka.  And, I walked over to Frankie, and I shook his hand, and I said, “You know, I wrote a song that you once sang.”

And, he said,

(Sings)
Where did we go wrong?
Didn’t we belong together?

 He knew the song right off the top of his head, and sang it to me at the party!  It was really a thrill.  I mean, this is one of the great voices of our time!  One of the most distinctive voices of our time.

 Tell us about your song, “It’s A Miracle”, that appeared on the album, “Barry Manilow II”.

Well, “It’s A Miracle” has a funny story.

You know, one day, Barry called from, I don’t know where, somewhere in Europe, and he said to me,  “I have good news and I have bad news.”  And I said, “Yeah?”

And he said, “Every time I hang up on you, and I tell you some wonderful thing that’s happened- ‘We just played for the Queen of England’ -meaning he and Bette- ‘We had just played for the Queen of England’, or ‘We just sold a sixty-thousand seat arena out’, or ‘We just did the Burt Bacharach Special’, any wonderful thing, you always say the same thing about these great events!  And, when I hang up the phone, it’s running in my head for the next week.  So, the bad news is, I stole something that you say to me every day.  The good news is, I left all the rest of the words blank!  ‘IT’S A MIRACLE!’ ’’

‘Ohhh, right!  I say that, don’t I?’

And, he said, “You say that don’t ya?  And you always do, and I wrote a song called, “It’s A Miracle”, it’s fantastic, now all I need is the rest of the words!”

And, when he came back to New York City, I wrote the rest of the words.  You know, it’s been his opening number for thirty-two years?  For as long as he’s been on the road, it’s been his opening number.  He’s tried a hundred other numbers as the opening number, but the one number that gets the audience excited in a familiar, friendly, comfortable, approachable way is “It’s A Miracle”, and it was our first hit single, too.

Absolutely.  I remember seeing him in concert the last time he was in Atlanta, which sadly, he hasn’t been back since then, and he, of course, opened with, “It’s A Miracle”.  And, the mentioning of the cities, it makes you think about a lot of different things.  But, I have to agree, a perfect opening number.

You know, what I wanted to do was, not make it a travelogue.  In the second verse,

(Recites)
I never knew you looked so good
I never knew anyone could
I must have been crazy
To ever have gone away

 I almost forgot what it’s like
Holding you near me at night
 But now that I’m home again
You know that I’m home to stay

 I warmed it up!  I took it from a traveling city song to a more emotional song of reunion, and I think that made the difference, and everybody was surprised, nobody expected it to go in that direction, least of all me, and I think that was my first breakthrough in terms of, my first understanding of what my contribution could be to a song that would be on the radio.

What lyricists out there have been the biggest influence for you?

Number One would have to be the English translations of “Jacques Brel is Alive and Well and Living in Paris”.  Eric Blau and Mort Shuman are some of the greatest lyrics ever written, and he wrote all these translations.  “No, Love, You’re Not Alone”, and,

(Recites)
Momma, do you see what I see?
On your knees and pray for me!
Mathilde’s come back to me!
Go ask the maid if she heard what I said and tell her to put the best sheets on the bed!
Mathilde’s come back to me!

 And when I heard that, I jumped right through the table.  I thought I’d never heard something so exciting, and so, I wondered, Gosh!  Will I ever feel that joy?  Will anybody love me that much?  Will I ever love anybody as much?  Will they come back?  It was a revelation.  And, Johnny Mercer, of course, wrote every song that matters, for the last hundred years.  It’s as simple as that.  Johnny Mercer wrote every song that will outlive all of us by a thousand years.  In the, really, pop world, Cynthia Weil is above and beyond, great.  I mean, Cynthia Weil is just a goddess of contemporary music.  She’s being installed in a couple of days in the Songwriters Hall of Fame.  They just gotta get the hot water pipe up her leg, and she’ll be thereforever.  And, lastly, I would have to say, Rod McKuen.  Rod McKuen wrote, “If you go away on a summer day, then you might as well take the sun away.”  Just beautiful!  And, I’ve been lucky enough to have Rod and Cynthia Weil as guests at my UCLA class that I teach January, February, and March, “Writing Lyrics That Succeed and Endure”.  I’ve been doing that, believe it or not, I just finished my seventeenth year!  Which meant that I started at five!  So, I must have been really hot stuff to be able to teach a class at a university at five years old!  Anyway, those are my idols.

Tell us about the song that you wrote, “This One’s For You”.

“This One’s For You” is an interesting song.  The person I wrote it for, and I, weren’t really speaking anymore.  And, it was my way of reaching out to try to make touch, and to talk to someone that I wished that I could talk to, but I had to do it over the radio.

 I’ll tell you a little funny story.

At the end of the year of Barry’s touring, he would meet me at a little restaurant, and he would say, “Okay, let me hear your Fall Collection.” 

And, he sat down opposite me at a table, and I started,

(Recites)
This one’ll never sell.
They’ll never understand.
I don’t even sing it well.
I try, but I just can’t!

 And, he pushed his hand up in front of me, and he said, “STOP!  Ihave to have a Number One song that says, ‘This one’ll never sell’, and I can’t even sing it!”  (Laughter) He says, “Forget about the rest of it, I love it already!” And, well, I read him the rest of the song.  You know, it’s really come back into prominence in the last couple of years.  I think there was a long period of time where “Even Now” was the keynote song.  But, in the latest production at the Paris Hotel of his show, “This One’s For You” has certainly been highlighted and gotten more acclaim than it ever has before.

 Well, you just mentioned “Even Now”.  Tell us about the song, “Even Now.”

Ah, gosh!  “Even Now”.  You know, in the wee small hours of the morning, everyone misses someone.  When you’re lonely, when you’re heart-broken, when you’re down and out, of course you miss someone. You miss everyone! Well, there were a thousand songs that said that.  But, I missed someone, even at the best time, at the best moment of my life, when I was flying high, when I had had the greatest success I ever imagined, or couldn’t even imagine!  I missed someone because they were just worth missing.  And, because I wanted them to be there to share it with me.  And, I couldn’t think of a song that said, ‘Even now, when I have come so far, I wonder where you are, I wonder why it’s still so hard without you.’  I couldn’t think of a song that said, ‘I’m okay, but where the hell are you, still!’  And, so I wrote “Even Now”.

Tell us about the song that you wrote, that was covered by Kenny Rogers, “Through The Years.”

Well, you know, “Through The Years” was again, a sentiment that I had not heard another song say.  My relationships, the key relationships in my life, have been- my mom, Barry, my brother, my partner for over thirty years- there was no song that said how much those relationships, or a relationship, contributes to your overall well-being and joy and comfort and growth, over a long period of time.  And, I, that’s all I knew about!  I wasn’t interested in people that I’d be friendly with for two days, or two weeks.  I wanted ‘forever’, and I was lucky to have a ‘forever’ in many different ways.  And so, I wrote the song, “Through The Years”.

The wonderful thing is that, because it is such a testimonial to a long-standing relationship, it’s been used as the hundredth-birthday song for George Burns; it’s been sung at the re-lighting of the Statue of Liberty; it’s become the Number One wedding song.  You know, it’s about things that last, and I’m about things that last, you know?  And, my relationships are about that.  And, once again, the commonality in all my lyrics is, if there’s another song that says that, I don’t know it.

Is there a song of yours that you could possibly pick as a favorite?

As a favorite song?  Well, probably.  There’s a song that no one knows, but it’s called, “I’ll Love You Back To Life.”  “I’ll Love You Back To Life,” there’s only one recorded version of it by Davis Gaines.   Davis Gaines is a Broadway artist who played “The Phantom of the Opera” three thousand eight hundred seventy-something times.  He recorded on “Against The Tide” on, one of his CD’s, both “All The Time” and “I’ll Love You Back To Life”.  And, there’s no question that “I’ll Love You Back To Life” is my favorite, my dearest lyric, and I always say if you put me into a Cuisinart, and you turned it on, what would come out would be “I’ll Love You Back to Life”.

Our special guest is Marty Panzer.  How did the idea for “An Evening with Marty Panzer” come to be?

Well, you know, it’s a very, that’s a very concurrent question, a very contemporary question.  A couple of years ago, I did a benefit for the Academy for New Musical Theatre, and they just added me on the bill of four or five other composers including Rod McKuen, and David Shire, and I don’t remember who else.  And, I was supposed to do fifteen minutes, I didn’t know of what.  But, I told a story, and then someone came out, and the story had led into this song that they sang, and then, I told another story, and somebody else came out and sang that song.

When I came off the stage after twenty minutes, the audience was just on fire!  Everyone loved it!  The head of the organization said, “You know, the next time we do a benefit, we don’t need the other five guys!”

And, I said, “Really?  Thank you!”

Well, about a month later, he called me and said, “If we give you a theatre and an audience, would you do an entire evening for us as a benefit?”

And, I said, “Sure!”

And, he got me the Coronet Theatre, and on one night, about three or four years ago, I did “An Evening with Marty Panzer” with many people singing.  With Diane Schuur, and with Eric McCormack, and with Monica Mancini, and with Barry Manilow, and with David Burnham, and Brian Green, all kinds of wonderful, magnificent, talented people, and it went over spectacularly well.

I wondered whether it was going over so well because so many of the people in the audience knew me, and loved me, and would have laughed (unintelligible) anyway.

I got a call a couple of months later from a guy in Walnut Creek, who asked me to do that same show for him in northern California, near San Jose.  And, I did.

Well, these people didn’t know the United States of America, much less “An Evening with Marty Panzer”. They reacted just as enthusiastically as the people in L.A.  So, I said, ‘You know, maybe there is something to this!’  Because it has a broader market than I thought.

Forty-eight hours ago, I did an event for the Society of Sheet Music, for the New York Sheet Music Society in New York City, to another hundred and fifty people that I had never met or seen, and didn’t even know what the organization was.  And, my inbox is flooded with congratulations and thank yous and appreciations and, “We must do this”, “We must make this an off-Broadway show”, “We must put you on tour”, “We must do-“, all of that stuff.  So, maybe the next phase of what Marty Panzer does is, “Evenings with Marty Panzer,” in one form or another.

I loved doing it!  I mean, you know, when I watch Barry on the stage in Vegas, you think, there just is no greater thrill than being on that stage!  It doesn’t matter what you do behind the scenes.  When you see Barry glowing on stage, you think, that is the highest calling!  So, even if I write Anna Karenina, and make it a number one single, it’s not the same as winking your eye, and singing, “Even Now,”  So, maybe an “An Evening with Marty Panzer” in some form or another will actually come to something.  There are also some producers putting together an original show based around songs in my catalog.  I’m more enthusiastic about that now, than I’ve ever been before.  As I said, especially after seeing Barry having such a fabulous time these past six years in Las Vegas.  So, we’ll see.  I’m going to do a week at the University of Miami in October, and there’s a possibility of two other events in New York City, and also a possibility of something at a college in Nashville.  So, we’ll see!  I’m just, you know, you have to move with the times, and maybe this is the time, while I’m still as positive and optimistic as I am, and have enough energy to cross the country, maybe that’s what I should be doing now.  So, I’m hoping to do that next.

With your songs having been recorded by people like Dionne Warwick, Dolly Parton, Julio Iglesias, and of course, Barry Manilow, you’ve certainly achieved the kind of success that songwriters are striving for.  There have been songwriters who’ve told me they always dreamed of a certain musician or band covering their work.  Do you have any that you’ve been interested in presenting your work to that have not yet?

You mean that are alive? (Laughter)

Yeah!

I’ve got some hot dead ones that I’d love to get to!  But in terms of the live ones, you know, when you become successful in a certain area, whatever that area is, you receive opportunities in the same field.  So, I’ve gotten requests from Michael Crawford, and Julio Iglesias, and Kenny Rogers, and Barry Manilow- all for similar type songs, male ballads, and things like that.  I would love to write songs for Maroon 5, or for the Rolling Stones!  But, they wouldn’t think to call me because my reputation is not in that area.  Not that I couldn’t do it, or wouldn’t want to do it, but that no one thinks of me for that when that situation comes up.  What I have done in the last, I guess, ten years, is I’ve written over a hundred songs for the Walt Disney Company.  So, I’ve written the newest songs in a generation for Cinderella, Belle, Mulan, Ariel, Sleeping Beauty, Snow White, Jasmine, Pocahontas- that was an enormous thrill, and it allowed me to speak in a different language than I had ever spoken in, or written in before, because they were women, and because Pocahontas had different things to say than Michael Crawford, and it’s been an absolute thrill.  My collaborator for all of that has been Larry Grossman for Pocahontas Two, my beloved friend, Don Grady, for all the other Disney songs.  And, I’ve had a wonderful time doing that, and it’s broadened my ability, I’m better at what I do now because of those opportunities, and I wish I would get other opportunities in different fields, than the automatic expected ones, that’s all I can say.  I’m grateful for the ones that I get, but, you know, it’s more interesting to write the song for the octopus villain in a Disney movie, than it is for another male vocalist love song.

So, when someone listens to a song you wrote, what is it you hope the listener gets from the experience of listening?

You know, I think today, so much is about the track.  So much is about the musical track, that people ignore the lyrics to an enormous degree.  They just don’t even hear the lyrics as they’re playing.  I sit in rooms with people who come to play me songs, and while their own lyrics are playing, they’re not even focused on them!  And, I think what I want people to get is the importance of the lyric, the value of a lyric, what a lyric can give to song, and how much it means.

You know, Barry said a quote that is really apt, and I told it to someone a couple of weeks ago, and they just jumped up for joy, they thought it was so appropriate.

Barry said, “A song is something you can sing in the shower.  Whereas, if you need twenty tracks to put together this cut, what you have is a production.  You have a record– but you don’t have a song.”

And, I think he’s right!  I think a song is music and a lyric, and when people listen to a song, I want them to hear the value, the importance of a lyric, and that’s what I teach at UCLA, and that’s what means the most to me.

Do we have time for me tell you my favorite lyric of all time?

We absolutely do.

Okay, well, I’ll just- there’s never been a class in seventeen years that I have not recited this lyric, because it informed me and educated me more than anything else.

(Recites)
Our little dream castle with every dream gone
Is lonely and silent,
The shades are all drawn
And my heart is aching
 As I gaze upon
A Cottage for Sale

The lawn we were proud of is waving in hay
 Our beautiful garden has withered away
Where we planted roses
The weeds seem to say
A Cottage for Sale

Through every broken window I see your face
But when I reach the window,
There’s only empty space
The key’s in the mailbox, the same as before
But no one is waiting for me anymore
The end of my story is there
On the door!
A Cottage for Sale

 What can I tell ya?  That is beyond brilliant.  I mean, that is a four-hour movie in a three-minute song.  It’s the most beautiful lyric I ever heard, and it is so compact, every word has significance, and is appropriate, it’s conversational, it’s descriptive, it paints a picture.

That’s what I want people to listen to in songs!  Songs were written that way until the producers took over, and it wasn’t about the song anymore, it was about the producer putting a hundred tracks behind somebody who had no real great song, but who could fake having a real song, if there were a twenty tracks playing at the same time.  So, I’m trying to get people to go back to writing the great songs, the songs that The Eagles wrote, the songs that Barry wrote, the songs that Johnny Mercer wrote, the songs that Cynthia Weil wrote.  The great songs, and to understand a great part of them, are the lyrics.  I’ve been doing it for seventeen years, and I hope, hope I’ve accomplished something!  We’ll hear as time goes on, whether the people in my class have come up with these kind of lyrics for the world.

You’ve been working on a book.  What has the experience of writing a book been like for you?

Well, you know, originally when I started thinking of this, of whatever the right form for presentation of “An Evening with Marty Panzer” would be, putting down the reminiscences, and leading into songs, and other songs, my first thought, and the first suggestions given me were, that I should put it in book form.  And, I started- I had a really terrific guy working for me, who helped me with the computer, and all kinds of stuff, and, and I just enjoyed telling him the stories.  And, I was telling him the stories, he was entering them into the computer.  When he left to go on to a job on Broadway, I stopped doing the book, because I didn’t have the same zest for telling these stories to somebody else.  But, I think now, I’m gonna go back to it.  Because I realized, that the response has been so consistent over all these years, if I can make the book as entertaining as the show is, well, it should be put down on paper, so that if I get hit by a truck tomorrow, these stories don’t die with me.

So, I’m gonna back to the book, which I have sort of left there, in behalf of the new work that came along.  It would seem to be more important to write a hundred songs for Disney, than to continue writing my life story.  I was living my life story.  But, right now, I think I need to go back, and while it’s still fresh in my mind, continue that book, and flesh out these stories on paper.  So, that’s on my agenda as well.

What is the best thing about being “Marty Panzer”?

You know, the best thing about being “Marty Panzer” is that I am Molly Panzer’s son, and Barry Manilow’s friend, and Gregg Rader’s partner, and Bernie Panzer’s brother.  That’s the best thing about being “Marty Panzer,” that I have roots and connections to wonderful, supportive, loving people for forty years, and I love every day, because I have the love of these people, and I’ve been very lucky to not be alone, and to not be doing this on my own, and to have the support of these people, so that’s what makes me happiest.

That’s a beautiful answer.  And now, for the final question.  We have listeners from all over the world…

How much is this question worth?  Is there a dollar value?

This is-

No?  (Laughs)

I don’t know how much this is worth.

Okay!  (Laughs)

Do you have any parting words of wisdom for our listeners?

The most important thing, I think, in whatever you do, is to live a good life, and to be out there in the world, and to listen to other people, and to hold on to those that love you, and give back as much as you can, and appreciate, as Diane Schuur did, how good life really is, and I think that the other things that seem like miracles, really come as an out-growth of your own good nature, your own talent, your own observation.  I think, just get up in the morning, and live your life to the fullest, and write it down!  And, believe in it!  And you will be surprised how many people out there feel the same way, and would love to communicate with you, and would love your communicating to them, your ideas.

Mr. Panzer, it has been fabulous to do this interview with you, but, you know, I was just thinking during this interview, a lot of people might think this is the first time we’ve ever talked, in this interview, but I realized when I was thinking about all these songs, that this isn’t the first time we’ve talked, because I’ve been listening to you tell me these stories and these messages, through these songs, that I’ve heard since I was six, seven years old, with my mother playing these records growing up.  So –

Really?

Yes, I’ve heard these songs my whole life, and so, I’d like to say, first of all, thank you for the great interview.  Thank you also, for these songs that have touched me for a very long time.

You are more than welcome, and I’ll tell you, that’s the best compliment you could ever give me.  To touch someone.  To make someone feel happy or sad.  I read on the bus one day, when I was ten years old, “To change the complexion of the day, that is the ultimate art.”  If you can make someone feel happier, or feel some emotion that they weren’t feeling before, you interacted with them, you’ve accomplished what God put you on the Earth for.  So, I thank you very much, and I accept that compliment with enormous humility, and enormous pride.

Well, again, thanks so much for the interview.  Let me know if you’re ever in Atlanta!

I will!  And, maybe this- I think maybe one of these early shows here of “An Evening with- “, maybe the first one is in Tallahassee, I dunno.  I don’t know the distance between Atlanta and Tallahassee, but, it’s in the same quadrant of the world, so, we’ll find each other, I promise.

TRANSCRIBED BY ANGELA L. WASHINGTON

Adrienne Anderson: Lyricist

ADRIENNE ANDERSON is the very talented lyricist who was introduced to us by lyricist Marty Panzer.  She is most known for the songs she co-wrote with composer Barry Manilow.  Some of the most beloved songs recorded and performed by Barry Manilow feature the lyrics of Adrienne Anderson, including Daybreak and Could It Be Magic.

Songs Adrienne Anderson wrote have been recorded by many great artists including Melissa Manchester, Bette Midler, Donna Summer and Isaac Hayes.  The late great Frank Sinatra sang a televised performance of the song “See the Show Again” on The Tonight Show with Johnny Carson.

Fans of Dionne Warwick may know Anderson’s work from the song “Deja Vu” which she co-wrote with Isaac Hayes.  With Peter Allen, Adrienne Anderson co-wrote “I Go to Rio” which became a signature song for Allen.  The song was later covered by the band Pablo Cruise as well as the late Peggy Lee.

Who is Adrienne Anderson?

Wow, well combination of things of course and evolving. I am uh much more of a family person now than I was when I started my career. I’ve got a daughter who is 25 years old and has a huge future of her own, a husband who I’m devoted to that I’ve been married to for almost 30 years. As far as my definition of myself as a careerist; that’s never really got away. I love the creative process. I’ve always loved the creative process and while my projects vary I hope to be involved one way or another in something having to do with music for the rest of my life.

 So speaking of life, let’s go back to the beginning.  What was life like growing up and where are you from?

I grew up in Manhattan and it was fantastic. I was very, very lucky. Child of privilege, I got exposed to the golden age of Broadway. When I was just old enough to have any idea of what I was watching. And I mean the Golden Age I mean South Pacific, Carousel, Guys and Dolls, The King and I, etc. all the original stage productions. When I was in the eighth grade West Side Story opened, changed my life. I went to see it four times. Studied theatre, studied dance, studied boys and was just very, very blessed to be in the cultural center of the western world and it had a life altering effect on me and I; I just loved growing up there.

Can you remember perhaps specific records or specific songs you heard around the house or on the radio?

When I was the youngest it was the Broadway stuff that had the most immediate impact on me because it was the height of Rodgers and Hammerstein and I was; just as I say; barely old enough to understand how great that stuff was. Also seeing it all on the stage, in real time, had a tremendous impact on me that I think lasted me all the way through. I mean to this day it’s scary how I can recall all those lyrics. I also had a Father who was very sophisticated musically who exposed me to jazz very early in life. So that I was very aware of Ella Fitzgerald, Sarah Vaughan, Lena Horne and Bix Beiderbecke and Art Tatum and people like that so that I was not your typical kid growing up where when I was in college and everyone was listening to those early Beatles records. I was a Charlie Mingus fan a Miles Davis fan, a Horace Silver fan. I owe a lot of that early exposure and sophistication to my father.

Did you always write?

No, no, not at all. Originally I wanted to be on the stage. I did summer stock, I had some potential I went to Carnegie Mellon which is a very renowned theatre department and then I studied in New York, and was quite serious about all that but then it was the sixties you know and theatre got really boring and the real theatrics and entertainment had switched over to music and I had great taste; I didn’t have a great voice but I had great taste so I put together a little act and that’s actually how I met Barry. It’s a cute story I actually hired him as my accompanist to help me put an act together for ten dollars an hour and that’s how we met.

What was your first impression of Barry Manilow when you met him?

Well he was just the sweetest, geekiest guy that I had ever met, ya know, with a great, great ability to play piano and accompany. Everybody used him. He and I found each other to be kindred spirits almost immediately because he had this passion towards jazz and so did I. And he thought I was the cat’s meow and for some reason he loved my voice and I loved his playing and we just hit it off from the first time that we did a song together; it was instantaneous. So what we did was we spent about eight or nine months putting this act that was so unique that the people who were managing me; when we presented the act to them; said they couldn’t book me because nobody would understand or recognize any of the songs that I was attempting to sing. So they fired Barry and put me with somebody else. But Barry and I continued on and he was just starting to write a little bit and he said well since I’m trying to write songs why don’t we write songs together. I said sure ok so we started writing songs together and it was the tail end of the brill era I mean really the tail end of the brill era. But we would write a batch of songs and I wrote the lyrics because I wasn’t going to play like him; I couldn’t play like him. But we did a lot of duets too, two part harmonies and just thought it was great, great and we would just go from floor to floor and knock on publishers doors and Barry would play and I would sing and we would play songs for a hundred dollars and that’s how it got started. And eventually I lost more interest in the performing end of it and gained more interest in the writing of it and that was pretty much because of what he and I were doing together.

 Can you remember the first song that you and Barry Manilow wrote that you’d say “this one’s a keeper”?

“Our Love Will Still Be There” was the name of the song. It was good; we wrote a lot of good stuff. I mean I don’t think anybody actually published that one but I think that was the first song. He was always a great keyboard player and he always had even from back in those days the same kind of charm and personality that he’s got now. Of course his ambition in those days was to be the next Nelson Riddle. He wanted to be an arranger. He never ever thought of himself as a vocalist but the fact is he had the same voice then that he has now. Who knew?

 I remember hearing him one time in concert, he was at Philips Arena in Atlanta and he was telling a little story on stage and he started out and he said “I have never been much of a singer,” and I thought “yeah right.”  But, I have heard that story from a couple people that they never thought of him as a singer, it was more like what Bette Midler said to him, “But, Barry, you don’t sing.”

Well the thing about Barry which I guess you could say similar was that and one of the reasons that I stopped pursuing that was because the key I think to being a success as a vocalist is getting that personality across. He was always, always able to do that and that’s why I don’t think he thought of himself seriously as a singer because he didn’t necessarily have the technique or the pipes but what he did have right from the beginning was his personality; which was his own that came through and had a charm and a warmth, and a humor that never really changed and a tremendous (technicality)

What was the first song that he recorded of yours that was a co-write?

That he recorded of ours?

 Yeah.

Well there’s actually an interesting story to this one because what happened was I was in New York. I was moving to the West Coast because I was marrying somebody who wanted to move to the West Coast and I sorta figured oh well, let’s give it a go but I was very apprehensive about breaking up the relationship with Barry and being on my own because I thought well if I don’t have him writing and playing what am I going to do; just gonna be on my own; so I determined to try to figure out how to do it by myself I rented this rehearsal space on 57th street for whatever twelve dollars an hour and this was in the midst of the Paul McCartney Era. I came up with this little tune called “Amy” that for what it was; was actually quite good and quite charming and my soon to be husband in those days was a big shot music publisher at CBS and he had a production company and everyone agreed that this thing should be recorded. So full production, so we went into the studio to record this song and of course Barry was around, at the last minute they said we need a scratch vocal Barry would you mind. So he went in and he did the vocal on it and that record Amy is what landed him his first record deal at Bell records. So it’s ironic because he didn’t even write that song. I wrote that song.

Interesting.

Yeah, a little bit of trivia there.

 You worked with so many people.  I don’t know if this is true, but I read something about you working with Frank Sinatra.

Oh I never worked with Frank Sinatra, but Barry and I have a song called “Why Don’t You See the Show Again” which he actually performed on the tonight show when Johnny Carson was the host and nobody knew he was gonna do it and I was on the West Coast and Barry was in New York and he called me screaming hysterical and said “You’re not gonna believe this” and it’s a three hour delay so I had to wait three hours to see it but sure enough he sang the song and he sang it really, really well. And it was definitely a high light of my career without a doubt.

Incredible.

Yeah.

 Well tell us about the song “Could It Be Magic” that Barry Manilow recorded.

Well I was already on the west Coast when he came up with the idea based on the Chopin prelude and he had come up with the chorus and was terribly excited played what he had over the phone to me and I became terribly excited because it was obvious that there was something really special that was starting to happen. I think I was staying at a hotel down in LA when I wrote the lyric to the verses. I still have the copy on Hotel stationery of what I wrote. It was one of those things that I just nailed it right from the get go. Needless to say it was time well spent.

 Is it possible to pick a favorite song of yours?

You mean with Barry?

 Just in general, any song.

Ah geez, not really, I mean I have maybe my half dozen favorites. I’ve just written so many songs, most of which have not been top ten hits. You know that’s the way it goes sometimes is that some of your favorites tend to be more obscure but certainly “Could It Be Magic” is right up there and with Barry we had a great time on the 2am Paradise Café project  which was a highlight for all of us. A great experience ya know Marty and I were present during the recording of that record and I don’t know if you’ve heard the story but that was a one take and wrote. I don’t know if you know the musicians who were playing on that record?

Yeah.  Fantastic record!

They were well rehearsed and Barry had written beautiful arrangements to link all of the songs, you’ve listened to it I guess so.

Certainly.

It’s all just continuous and that’s Barry’s music. They just did the whole thing without any interruption when they were over, finished everybody kinda looked at each other and said “is this possible” but it was. Ya know it’s very unusual.

What about “Daybreak.”  What inspired the lyrics for that song?

Uh it’s kind of a funny story because when I wrote that lyric I really wasn’t thinking about Barry at all I didn’t think; I was thinking more in terms of a gospel R&B group I didn’t even show him the lyrics he was at my house and it was just sitting on a pile and he said what’s this; I said oh it’s just a lyric ya know and he said give me a couple minutes with this. I swear I remember I went down downstairs and made us lunch and by the time I had finished making us lunch he had come up with the music and ya know little could I have imagined that that little lyric was going to get the kind of mileage that it did but again it was one of the. A lot of lyrics that I wrote for Barry over the years were custom customized for him and that’s a great luxury when you can write for an artist. Especially when you can write for an artist that you know as well as I know him because I could kind of get under his skin and really, really personalize. Whereas if your just writing a lyric just to music that’s going out there to try to find and artist its very different but with “Daybreak” I certainly, I certainly didn’t have him in mind for that one at all.

 It’s a fantastic song.  I don’t think anybody could ever listen to that song, the words and the music and be in a bad mood.

(Adrienne laughing)
I can’t imagine that.

Well ya know, its, it’s great, ya know, it’s given us both a great deal of pleasure. Ya know I try to make my lyrics as personal as I can in terms of my own point of view. Uh, I am by nature an optimistic so I guess that definitely came across in that lyric.

What is it like to have someone like Dionne Warwick record one of your songs, that song “Déjà vu,” it has to be incredible.  She’s such a legend.

We were pinching ourselves. Barry produced that record and that was surreal because I was, uh we both were huge Dionne Warwick fans and that whole Bacharach/David catalog was just up there with the best of the ya know what was written in pop music in the mid-20th century and such a unique and perfect talent. I remember going into the studio while she was recording “Déjà Vu” her nonchalance was just astonishing ya know she was painting her nails while she was recording and puffing on cigarettes and then she would ya know just sing and she was just perfect and I remember Barry and I looking at each other in the control room and saying is this actually happening (laughing) we were both stunned and fans ya know like we were of a ya know younger generation growing up listening to all of the body of her work we were just in such awe.

What about your work with Peter Allen? Tell us about how that came to be.

Well Peter had a publisher in LA that I had a, a nice relationship with and so we were actually put together. We knew each other very casually just from knowing people in common and so it wasn’t we had never met but we weren’t friends we just kind of knew each other. So it was set up for us to write together. I had come up with some ideas, let’s see I don’t remember exactly it was some idea that was rejected immediately and the next think I know he’s saying well why don’t we write this and he started to launch into this music for “Rio” and the story as it goes is that we were just in an office publishers everyone had gone to lunch it was just him and me and the piano and we wrote the entire song in one hour with not a word ever changed and not a note ever changed and um when everybody returned from lunch we were terribly excited and we sat everybody down and said woah listen to this. Peter played and I don’t know if we both sang or just Peter sang but we just kind of knew we had nailed it. I don’t think anybody knew that that copyright was going to end up having the ledge that it’s had. This has just been astonishing ya know on a worldwide level. It’s been an amazingly successful copyright. But you can it’s just a crazy business because ya know you can write great stuff that never sees the light of day or you can write great stuff that takes you an hour like “Daybreak” took me twenty minutes to write. Then you feel almost guilty like this isn’t right. Ya know how can I be making this kind of money on something that took twenty minutes to write. I guess a lot of it is just circumstantial and I was very lucky I was very, very lucky. If you look at I don’t know what it is the percentage of people even in those days who earned a living writing lyrics I’m sure it was miniscule then and probably non-existent now.

You also have worked with someone who is an upcoming guest of ours: Melissa Manchester.  What is your impression of her?

I adored her and we wrote a lot together and in those days in those days it was kind of different there were no restrictions her producer at the time just loved everything that we did and there was never anything held back in terms of we would just write stuff and it would just go right into the recording studio but Melissa and I were very, very close and we were very, very young. She was younger than I was and still is but there was a creativity and a free spiritedness to our work that was just; just delicious we didn’t feel any kind of commercial restrictions and I think there was an innocence in terms of being creative in a way that once you become more seasoned you tend not to be quite as because you tend to play it more safe and be a little bit more structured. But we had wonderful; wonderful times sharing the creative process together.

 Kind of working our way to the present, not too long ago you worked on “City Kid,” the musical and you’re working on something now.  I was wondering if you could tell us about these projects you’ve been working on lately.

Well you know instead of taking a day, a week or a month these projects take years. City Kid was kinda my brain child and I recruited two great, great guys to collaborate with me Peter Bunetta and Rick Chudacoff who are the producers and quite successful. And I came up with this concept to turn what I thought initially was going to be a concept album into a stage production. I sort of undertook this myself in terms of developing the story and urging them along because they thought I was crazy and uh it wasn’t there thing at all. They had never thought in terms of wanting to do Theatre. I actually found a great group outside of Seattle who fell in love with wanting to help develop the project and so they did and we had a workshop and a full stage production up there some of the best experiences of my life. You can’t compare being involved with a group of theater kids with making a record because theater is such a community experience, a collaborative experience so ya know where as if you’re writing a song for a record you write it with somebody or alone, then you’re in a recording studio, ya know, it’s pretty quiet there’s not that many people there. Whereas here it was all about people and so my endeavor was to try and contemporize Broadway what has proven to be a very, very difficult thing to do. Even if you saw the Tony’s this year you could see that some of the stuff that was written a year ago sounds like It could have been written forty years ago so it’s very, very tough. Broadway is very, very tough. We ended up finally after having a substantial run up in Seattle uh coming down to LA and having an eight week run down here which actually proved quite successful. However we were in a 99 seat equity waver with a cast of 17 and six band members all union so the costs were unrealistic and we were forced to shut down before we found what we needed to move on so as of now “City Kid” is in limbo. It’s been very hard for me but in the meantime I’m pursuing this Pawnbroker project which is really, really a horse of a different color and isn’t pop at all, is very serious. I’m collaborating with a fellow by the name of Eduardo Del Barrio who is a very serious composer. I’ve adapted the book which you know I think I’ve gotten pretty good at. It’s a wonderful story there was a film that was made of the novel in the mid-sixties that Sid Lumet directed that starred Rod Steiger that won an Oscar, Quincy Jones did a superb score. It was a very much heralded property in its day and there’s still a generation or two that certainly know “The Pawn Broker” Your probably just too young oh but these are very, very long range projects ya know so that kinda suits me in this stage of my life.

What is the best thing about being Adrienne Anderson?

The best thing about being Adrienne Anderson?

Yes ma’am.

Oh, well I guess the best thing about being Adrienne Anderson is that I’m a person who’s always been pretty comfortable in her own skin. I believe what I believe and I feel what I feel and I don’t tend to hide those feelings. I’ve been a very good Mother and a Very good Wife and a very good friend. People love me, I love them. There’s just not too much of a gap between my inner life and my outer life and I think that’s probably the best part of being me and the fact that I’ve been able to live out a lot of my fantasies. I’ve been Very, very, very lucky to have had the opportunity to do that.

 I have two final questions.  One is kind of light-hearted and then the other is a little more serious.  The light hearted one first: Your all time favorite meal.

(Adrienne laughs) Oh…. a good steak and a piece of Chocolate cake

Oh yeah?  How do you have the steak?

Medium rare.

Likewise.
(laughter)

My last question: what would you like to say to all the people listening?

Oh, I would say find you passion and live it and be good to each other along the way.

 Thank you so much for this interview.  It’s been a great pleasure.

Well thank You I’ve enjoyed it.

TRANSCRIBED BY LISA MARIE BOHLAND-LUNDGREN

Enoch Anderson: Lyricist

ENOCH ANDERSON has been writing songs with composer Barry Manilow since the 1970s.  As he tells us in this interview, for many years he was known as the one who never had a single.  With the release of 15 Minutes, Manilow’s first album of original songs in years, Enoch Anderson began getting a lot of recognition for his ability with words.  Anderson wrote lyrics to almost all of the songs on the album, with the exception of one song written by Adrienne Anderson and a few written by Manilow himself.

Incredibly, Enoch Anderson said this was his first radio interview.  We hope you enjoy what he had to say, whether you listen in or read our transcript.

Ladies and Gentlemen, it is with great pleasure, we welcome our special guest, lyricist, Enoch Anderson. Thank you so much for making the time to join us.

Thank you.

My first question, who is Enoch Anderson?

I’m going to have to redefine myself.  It used to be easy.  I was the one who never had a single. Of all the people Barry worked with, I was the one who had never had a song released as a single, and I remember once, a fan actually came up to me, a fan of Barry’s and said “huuuuugh, ‘I know who you are, you’re the one who never had a single,’ so I’m going to have to redefine that because now there’s a single out.

Well that’s right, there’s a new album out full of songs co-written by our special guest Enoch Anderson, it’s Barry Manilow’s album ‘15 Minutes,’ on Barry’s own independent label, Stiletto. So, we’re going to go back a little bit, what was life like growing up for you?

I grew up in a small mining town in Northern Canada no references forother people my age , no Sesame Street, or no Mickey Mouse Club so, little bit different in that way perhaps.

And what kind of music did you hear around the house?

My sister and brother were teenagers, so I was hearing popular music at the time through the radio, I don’t know if there’s anybody out there who knows what 78s were, you know, the old, old, old records, and they were old Vaudeville routines and music, there were some Broadway shows out with hits my brother and sister had, and so it was a real mixture of stuff, it was like a crash course in a century of popular music almost.

Can you remember examples of early writing that you did, not necessarily just lyric writing, but just any kind of creative writing?

Yeah, I used to make up stories and try to get an adult to write them down for me before I understood how to write, and when I could write, I would make little books and assemble them and bind them together with string, I had to write and illustrate them, and they were all about dogs, because I couldn’t draw human ears.

Tell us about the first song you ever wrote if you can remember it.

It was when I was at high school, there was a local theatre group that was going to put on a melodrama and I think I tried out for it, they didn’t want me, but I wrote a song for the villain to sing, and I gave it to them and I didn’t get any response, nobody said anything about it and I didn’t hear it again, but when the show went on, I went to see it and they were singing my song. I didn’t get any credit on the program or anything; welcome to show business, but that would be the first time (Enoch laughs).

Where do you get the inspiration for your lyrics?

I don’t really know, sometimes I can tell you, there used to be a little park near where I lived, and on Sundays it was crowded with divorced fathers and their kids, and it was a convenient place for them to go when they only had one day together, and I wrote a song called ‘Sunday Father,’ so that I can make a direct connection, but a lot of times, I don’t know. I’ve told the story, I was going to bed very tired one night, and suddenly in my imagination there was this young housewife who was very unhappy with her situation and I wrote down a lyric, and I was kind of annoyed because I wanted to go to sleep, but I felt like  I owed it to her, she was very real to me, and that was the song ‘Sandra,’ I called it ‘Sandra’ because I thought I don’t know anybody called Sandra so nobody could say I wrote it about her, but, so many of the married women I knew, thought I had, so(Enoch laughs), I have no idea where that came from, sometimes ideas just float in.

What lyricists or songwriters have influenced you the most?

There are so many I’ve liked and if I try to name them, then I’m going to be upset later  because I will miss some, of course the older ones, Leonard Cohen, Paul Simon, so many.

Barry Manilow has made a lot of records lately of other artists material, but in his own right, as we know, he’s really an incredible songwriter and I wish he did more original albums, but I was going to talk about the album ‘Here At The Mayflower,’ it’s a great album and it features a number of songs you co-wrote with Mr Manilow, how did your songs come to be found on the album?

He told me about the idea, I remember, this huge apartment building in Brooklyn where a lot of people lived and it was based on where he actually grew up, I wrote a song called ‘Do You Know Who’s Living Next Door.’ As far as I’m concerned a number of lyricists wrote on the album and I don’t know what the others experiences were, but as far as I’m concerned, I think for the other songs of mine he used, there were things he had and he just saw a way for them to fit in, in that case he didn’t say, “I need you to write something for the elevator guy thing” or something like that.

 So what did you think of the album “Here At The Mayflower”?

Oh I like it very much because it showcases his creativity, he would be right along with you; he’d like to do more original material, and it was not a sure fire thing, it was telling stories of human experience, it wasn’t just trying to churn out formula singles, and I like that as a project that meant a lot to him.

 Now, you just mentioned, you said that you think that Barry Manilow would concur and probably would like to do more original stuff, without speaking for Barry Manilow, why do you suppose it is that he’s done less of his original music?

I think everyone is trying to adjust to the changing reality to the music business, in just the last few years, it’s changed so much, people often don’t buy albums any more, they download tracks, I think that he had something that was working very well for him, for several years, releasing these collections of familiar songs.

Do you have a favorite song of yours from that album “Here At The Mayflower”?

I guess I would say the song ‘Border Train,’ because there was something very different for me, usually I write a lyric, send him the finished lyric and he sets it to music, and this time it was the other way round, he sent me a melody and he said, “see if you can write to it” and it was this very evocative, haunting melody and he didn’t tell me anything about what he wanted it to be about, or anything, and so I had to see what it did for me, it made me feel as if I were on a train at night and I didn’t know where I was going and I went with that, and then I forgot about it, over the years, til I was in Vegas, seeing a show, and he did the song, which he had never done in concert before,  he just did it I guess, and I liked it so much and I thought I’d forgotten that, it’s got such a beautiful melody and it’s so haunting in a way, so, that would be my stand out right now.

We’re talking with lyricist Enoch Anderson. Here we are in two thousand and eleven and its ten years after Barry Manilow’s last album of original songs, he has a new album or original songs and today, the day we are recording this interview, ‘15 Minutes’ has been released and you co-wrote the songs on the album, so tell us,  how did the idea for this album, ‘15 Minutes’ come to be?

It was Barry’s idea, the stories all around us, there’s tabloids, TV shows, magazines at the checkout counters, over and over you see somebody becoming a sudden celebrity, and it seems you’re going to be hearing of a relationship falling apart for the person, there’s going to be rumours of substance abuse, there’s going to be professional problems, it’s a road that seems to meet the same terms almost no matter who the person is. The modern media merits all that, and he’d like to do a story album based on it and I was trying to show that I knew what he meant, and I said “I’ve got a title for you, 15 Minutes”, thinking of the Andy Warhol quote, and he liked that, so we were off and that’s how it all started rolling.

Very, very interesting, so, how did you and Barry Manilow begin the undertaking of the writing of these songs?

I started working on a song called ‘15 Minutes’, I sent that to him, which is the first song on the album and from that point on we were on our way. He would tell me the story that he wanted to represent and what would be going on and then I would work on the idea.

What were some of the initial concepts that you had, what were some of the ideas that you had when he told you about the album, other than the title?

Well, I was struck by the fact that it wasn’t going to be making a celebrity who crashed and burned, it wasn’t going to be sensational, going for dirt, it wasn’t going to be superior and wise and giving them advice or something, it was compassionate, it was a take on the human experience from inside the head of somebody going through it and people become spectacles to the public, but they’re people and usually very talented to find themselves hitting these skids that everybody seems to hit. So I thought there was a human angle to it that gave another fact to what we were seeing on the supermarket tabloids every day.

What is it like working with Barry Manilow?

It’s really better than I can tell you (Enoch laughs). It’ll sound as if I’m trying to be very politically correct by saying nice things, but, it’s a treat, we get along, now we work apart, I’m usually in Los Angeles and I write a lyric and I email it to him, and wherever he is, he sets it to music and he emails the melody back to me, so we’re not hunched over a piano in the same room,  we get along, we’re both articulate, so we can express what we mean, it’s just very creative and productive. There’s one funny story I’ll tell you, last year we were in the studio working on the ‘15 Minutes’ album and there was something that needed re-writing, and so I was saying “what do you need, or what has to be shortened, what do we do?” And he was showing me and we had a lead sheet and I was scribbling things on it and he was scribbling things on it, and we went to lunch and by the time we came back from lunch, the re-write was all finished and was fine and I thought “WOW, we can even work together when we ARE together, that almost never happens (Enoch laughs).

So, today the album has been released, ‘15 Minutes’ by Barry Manilow, what do you think about the album?

I think it’s exciting, whether people like it or not, it is a story we wanted to tell, nothing was changed behind our backs, nothing was forced on us, I don’t think he made a mistake in that direction, because he went into heavy rock territory, that would be the story and it would upstage the story he wanted to tell. It’s about a phenomenon that’s going on around us every day, the feeding frenzy over famous people, and this is what we meant. Barry could have gone on recording collections of old favorites forever and made lots of money, but he wanted to take a chance and be creative, and I’m hoping for his sake that it’s well received. Sooner or later you just have to turn it loose and see if it flies, so, I’m hoping people like it.

So you’re saying he was willing to take a chance again. (Paul and Enoch laugh).

Hey that could be a good song.

I had to. So, do you have a favorite song from the ‘15 Minutes album’?

I go back and forth, right now it’s a song that…. I liked it cos I knew it needed to be there, it had to be from when the guy hits rock bottom, he’s lost his fame, he’s lost his success, he feels his made a fool of himself and it’s all gone, and there has to be a turnaround point. The nice thing about hitting rock bottom is finding you’ve got some place to put your feet. I was in the supermarket late at night, coming home from work, all of a sudden this lyric hit me, and I had nothing to write with, and I had to mumble it to myself like a crazy person in the checkout line and get home fast. ‘Trainwreck’ that was the special to me, so I had no idea, so all of a sudden it landed in my lap.

We’re talking with the lyricist Enoch Anderson. When someone listens to a song you wrote, what is it you hope they get out of the experience?

I hope they recognize something that feels authentic to them, as I said, I don’t always know where the songs come from, they are not often from my own experience, I’m not a divorced father, which is the story of ‘Sunday Father’, ‘Sandra’ is about a young married woman, which I certainly am not, so if the divorced Dad or housewife says to me that “yeah, that’s how I felt, yeah, that was it, I identified with that”, then I am pleased.

What is in the future of Enoch Anderson?

Oh I’d like the privilege of going on with more creative work.

I have two final questions, one, somewhat light hearted and a little more of a serious question, the light hearted one first, what is your all time favorite meal?

Well, I love to eat, something I particularly like, Indian food, I love curries and that sort of thing, maybe lamb vindaloo.

Oh man, that sounds fantastic; I am also a curry devotee. So, the last question. Barry Manilow’s fandom is worldwide, thanks to technology, people from everywhere will be able to hear this interview, do you have any parting words of wisdom for our listeners?

Well, I’m not the wisest owl in the forest, I don’t know if I have wisdom, I guess all I would say is, look at an audience having a good time, if you’re at a movie, or if you’re at a concert, it’s when the audience is responding, look around and see how many different types of people there are, look at the diversity, it’s human experience to find us together, and there’s a lot more binding us together than there is sending us apart, that’s the value I think of good entertainment, and I think that’s something you can take away from that experience.

TRANSCRIBED BY ROSALIND WINTON